Green pumps toughness as on Tarmogoyf, red pumps power as on Cenerivore, Gruul does this.

I have the feeling that if multiple goyfs are on the battlefield at the same time it's going to get really confusing which gets how much.

Do you think so? I thought it can't be too hard since the *s are the same on all goyfs and you just have to look where the "1+"s are. But maybe you're right and board complexity and combat math get confusing. Tesing will show.

­Tarmogoyf wasn't enough for you?

What is this comment supposed to tell me?

I think Link is surprised that you thought you wanted a creature that's better than Tarmogoyf, given Tarmogoyf's reputation.

Alex is correct. Sorry for being impolite about it.

it's fine. he maxes out at what, 8/8? pretty fair for 2cc.

Only one more power than "OMG! Much aggro, so banned"? Well I guess it's not substantially worse than one of the nastiest cards printed in recent memory...

All right thanks for all the comments and the discussion everyone :)

First I want to explain again that this is a Custom Legacy Cube and I want it to live up to every part of that name. Legacy is a format where Tarmogoyf sometimes is the worst creature in a deck (think RUG Delver), so making cards that are around the same powerlevel as Goyf is exactly what I want to do here. Also we don't have to forget that it still is a Cube. I want to draft this and the set is not supposed to be developed as though any card could go 4 times in every deck.

Now let's see how much better than Tarmogoyf this card actually is given the context we have. Pyrogoyf locks you into GR which means all the BUG decks that exist couldn't play it anyway. That mostly leaves us with Zoo, Jund and RUG Delver. Zoo is close to unplayable right now so it could need a slight buff very much. It would clearly play this card. RUG Delver wants blue mana at every point in the game. I think they would still play Tarmogoyf even if this card existed just because it can be played with Tropical Island + Wasteland. Jund always wants to have black mana in the first three turns to play Thoughtseize, Hymn to Tourach, Abrupt Decay and Liliana of the Veil. It wouldn't play this card and if it would, then only as Tarmogoyf 5-8.

In this set we obviously don't have exactly the same decks as in actual Legacy but some principles stay the same. Removal is cheap and efficient, there are creatures like True-Name Nemesis that laugh in the face of this and there will even be cards like Yawgmoth's Bargain to give combo decks a shot. Also, given that this is just Tarmogoyf and Cenerivore all in one I guess it fits right in there.

For those who still think the card might be oppressive: Worry not. Rest in Peace and friends are coming right your way ;)

Fair enough; nothing wrong with designing overpowered stuff as long as you know that's your intention. Expect everything to explode into a fireball of "did you counter my plan immediately? No? Then you die now!" which sure, that can be fun :)

It's a shame there's no easy way to add a comment to the banner, so that you can warn commentators in advance of a sets ethos. I expect you'll have more or less this conversation a number of times :)

Other things to say, then - you'll also obviously want some discard powered stuff in your set (and in these colours, which is an unusual colour for it)

Hahaha, as I said on the Front Page I'm working on this project for about 4 years now so yes, at the beginning there was a point when everything exploded into a fireball of "Oops, guess you're dead".

Right now though that doesn't happen anymore. The Archetypes that I'm designing for have been selected to have strengths and weaknesses against each other so against every strategy there should be a viable counter-strategy.

Well there is the Front Page and other details pages which sadly people don't always read too carefully. And yeah, I suspected to have this conversation several times but as long as I get feedback it's worth it. Yet I guess a more direct clarification on the front page could help it.

As far as the discard goes, I tried to spread cantrips and carddraw from blue into other colors to help the powerbalance of the set since I don't want it as blue-centered as actual Legacy is. As a result I ended up with a lot of red looting or other draw/discard variations in red which should help growing Goyfs. Look at Chandra of the Flame and Hymn to Regatha for this. I'd like to get some honest opinions especially on the latter.

Any cardset with the word "Cube" in the name tends to mean I refrain from power-level comments, because people designing custom cubes tend to be (a) designing cards only intended to play within one particular ecosystem, and (b) often want to push power levels for the fun of it.