Conversation: Recent Activity
Conversation: Cardlist | Visual spoiler | Export | Booster | Comments | Search | Recent activity |
Mechanics |
Recent updates to Conversation: (Generated at 2024-05-12 02:17:47)
Conversation: Cardlist | Visual spoiler | Export | Booster | Comments | Search | Recent activity |
Mechanics |
Recent updates to Conversation: (Generated at 2024-05-12 02:17:47)
I think so. I think the point is that if your third (splash) color doesn't show up, you can still mutate
Do the weird hybrid costs only show up in mutate costs? I think (wg)(r)(r) is much less off-putting if the main mana cost expects you to play main red with the other colours anyway
I don't think so, I think it's just "parasitic" and "not parasitic"
Thanks, I didn't know about linear and modular...
Is there an opposite of parasitic/insular?
I really like the mutate mechanic. Companion's a bit weird, but seems fine too.
That's linear vs modular, also an old pair of design terms. Linear mechanics really need you to build a deck around them, so you tend to run a lot of cards with the mechanic (like metalcraft). Modular mechanics can be played on their own with no loss (like cycling). Mutate is a little linear, because it does reward you for having more mutate, but it can also be run on its own fine
Parasitic specifically means it only works with other cards from its own set/block. Most linear mechanics are parasitic the first time, but can become less parasitic if they get used more (like slivers)
Insular is a lot better of a word. I hadn't thought about it.
I agree mutate isn't insular. The abilities that specifically reference it and only work with it are probably insular, but you make a good point that it's not a problem because it encourages deck building for the new mechanics.
My main problem with hybrid cards is, at least for me, i find them to have a deceptively tight design space.
I'd kind of assume that since there are more colors, there would be more cool abilities, but in fact, since you have to make sure every possible color combination of the card fits the color pie, it really restricts what you can do with the card.
I still like hybrid cards though, they're really good to look at to get a reminder about the color pie.
First, the word 'parasitic' is unintuitive for how they use the word. They should use the word 'insular'.
Mutate is not insular because it works with every (nonhuman) creature. It can target any (nonhuman) creature. (Aside, in some cases like Human Insect or Human Werewolf can't be mutated? But in Innistrad they did transform.)
Second, that triggered ability is just a rider for new mechanics. It's a bonus that encourages linear deckbuilding. There's always abilities that encourage certain themes or mechanics.
> "when this creature mutates" abilities are parasitic?
A bit linear. But mutate itself works with any non-Human creature and even a single card can trigger its own "When this creature mutates" ability, so to say "When this creature mutates" abilities are parasitic is like saying "When this creature exploits a creature" abilities are parasitic. They always do something, but aren't quite as open-ended/modular as "When this creature enters the battlefield or mutates" or "Whenever you sacrifice a creature".
The fact that you can mutate any non-Human creature makes this far less parasitic than host/augment.
The best comparison would be to ask: Would a creature with bestow be parasitic if it had the ability like "Whenever this or enchanted creature is bestowed an Aura, do something"? It still works with any creature, so it's not problematic.
The cards that reduce mutate costs etc. are more parasitic.
There's nothing wrong with parasitic mechanics in moderation. It's also not that parasitic, because you can run mutate creatures in any deck and still get the trigger. It's somewhat linear, because it rewards you for having multiple mutate cards in the same deck
Am I correct in understanding that mutate is parasitic- or rather, "when this creature mutates" abilities are parasitic? It's not the first time Magic has had a parasitic mechanic (if mutate is), and I doubt it will be the last.
The official stance often quoted and repeated since 2018 (and probably earlier) used to be: "Reaction to the Alara Reborn Cards is what made us realize mixed hybrid symbols are a mistake."
Now it's a mistake they intentionally repeated. ;)
Maybe the wedge cards for the Messenger Falcons cycle are gonna be in Ikoria, too. :D
@Sorrow, yeah, I was already feeling 100% vindicated just by the amonkhet punchcards, but this has me over the frickin' moon XD
@Secret they've done costs like that before, though, in Alara Reborn IIRC. in my opinion, it was inevitable that it would happen again, really.
On the list of things that Ikoria does and would have gotten your design ripped apart by the custom card community: mana costs like . I know, I've been using much more considerate costing schemes than that and got criticized for it.
Though I'm going to side with the custom card community here in that the specific sample cards are already so complex that this cost is just making things even more noisy.
I also get where they are coming from though on mutate costs, maybe: It's a perfect cost that tells you "If you've been splashing one of these two colors to get this card in and dindn't draw the mana, you can still mutate as long as you have the correct main color."
It's weird and pragmatic. But it made its way onto a real card.
I haven't been playing this game at all, and looked up the last couple sets like once each, so i don't know how good they've been, but these new mechanics seem pretty interesting, more so than what I felt with my very quick looks at Theros 2.0 and Throne of Eldraine.
Can't wait for more big stompy bois.
Oh gosh, mutate is entertaining. It reminds me of what Goblin Artisans were trying to do with Head/Body of mecha assembling into one giant robot. It's a way of making a "make one giant creature" mechanic that's not too punishing if you don't draw the right parts together, and gives you some reason to do so rather than just try to play all the creatures separately.
It seems too rules-headache-y to be printed but I guess they thought it was ok!
It's not totally open ended because it doesn't give you any way to combine two non-mutate cards. But you can take the text box of any 1/1 from an older set and easily staple it to a big stompy mutate creature you have now, that's more melvin/johnny than I expected to see :)
I'm happy for you, Circeus, that you made the ability counters years before Ikoria. You knew what Magic could do, Wizards just hadn't gotten there yet.
I think Innistrad probably first changed the ideas of what could be physically done in Magic with the introduction of DFCs that required a checkbox card. Amonkhet had the punchcard, and I think doing that is a big precursor what Ikoria would be willing to do.
I'm coming around on mutate just being a modified bestow. Still think keyword counters are a terrible memory issue
Oh, cool. Yeah, I can see why people would be doubtful, because without the physical counters as reminders wizards have always avoided using multiple counters for reminders. But it makes a lot of sense, well played!
That and mutate also reminds me a little bit of my superhero set where I tried to have different creatures all contributing to one giant creature with the abilities of all of them. Like slivers but where only one creature gets all the benefits at once. But I never really refined it to the point where there was an implementation that made sense.
I've spent years trading magic designs here. It's sort of scary how long. But only know a few of you in real life.
I live in the UK, my wife and I are fortunate to be able to continue working from home much like usual. Video socialising is going surprisingly well.
How is everyone else coping? Is anyone in a country NOT dealing with this pandemic?
So, years ago I came up with literally the exact same ability counters that are now in Ikoria, and I got ripped apart for it.
Guess who is really really smug right now? >:D
So many of these cards are interesting, hilarious, and/or fun, and I'm jealous that I'll never have access to them.
Start here.
I recall a lot of those mechanics from the playtest cards from articles and social media answers. A trip down memory lane for enfranchised players, I suppose, and just more Un-style fun for everyone else.
Golgari Death Swarm and Neldanc Coven are both obviously referencing the infamous GDS3 question.
Some internet celebrity made a video using your research paper :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdmODVYPDLA
Edit: Timestamp 4:42
Any thoughts on the power level of Blick, Noir City Butcher?
May I have thoughts on the power level of Crystalline Spires (which would be expanded into a cycle)? The goal is to seed dual lands into the first set of Anydria which could be used as blue duals for the second set, without calling out blue or using blue mana symbols.
Ooh, yes, those seem pretty sensible.
I feel there's still a hole with colour indicators. There's so much overlap with mana costs, and rules text, but we can't quite do away with any one of the three. If you're going to have colour indicators, I feel like they should (a.) be on all cards (b.) be clear enough that you can actually tell the card's colour from them, especially for multicolour cards. They're small enough that I feel they don't help in b&w very much. I feel like most people realistically look at the mana cost or card frame, or just know. But I'm not sure what works. Maybe find a place in the card for colour symbols, one for each colour not just one circle? Or change the mana cost, so "|" means "5 mana incl two red, g, and b" and "|{r]" means "this card is r/g/b but has no mana cost". But that'd still need a way of showing when a card cost R but was colorless, etc.
I quite like the idea that hybrid-phyrexian would lead to using it for standard "pay 2 life" payments, like the energy symbol. Maybe it shouldn't be round though.
Oh yes! I love those flavour-colourpair parings. Dignity seems to fit really well. I particularly like that it fits into the useful mechanic space where you always CAN use it, it's not a null ability by itself (by having only one creature in play, or using it without tapping any creatures first) but it's a lot better with support creatures.
Is Hooliganry broken?
Anyone have any thoughts on the power level of Farrah, Duchess of Gallasthene